Something Needs to be Done

We want to hear what your club is doing to bring in new members. Tell us what works, and give credit to those who are making the effort.

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AlanF
Posts: 6973
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2005 8:22 pm
Location: Maffra, Vic

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#241 Postby AlanF » Sun Jan 08, 2017 8:32 pm

Norm,

Some of our recent members have been able to join the VRA prior to having a Shooters Licence on the understanding that they need the membership as a "reason" to get a Licence. When the Licence is produced, the VRA is informed and the shooter can shoot unsupervised. Have you had a different experience?

Alan

Razer
Posts: 500
Joined: Tue Mar 04, 2008 8:44 pm
Location: Orange,N.S.W.

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#242 Postby Razer » Sun Jan 08, 2017 9:35 pm

In NSW there is a P650 form which any unlicensed shooter can fill in and sign and then shoot on the range. It is only good for that day and only on the range.
Obviously there has to be a RO or responsible person from the club as the form needs to be filed, just in case!
When Orange Rifle Club had a range and was still in existence, we often used them.
The same form is used at the SSAA rimfire range in Orange to allow unlicensed shooters to try out shooting or to allow a friend to shoot.
It is simple and straightforward.
This alleviates the need to turn unlicensed shooters away which is basically destroying our clubs and depriving them of future members.

Norm
Posts: 837
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 10:21 pm
Location: Gippsland, Victoria

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#243 Postby Norm » Mon Jan 09, 2017 1:05 am

AlanF wrote:Norm,

Some of our recent members have been able to join the VRA prior to having a Shooters Licence on the understanding that they need the membership as a "reason" to get a Licence. When the Licence is produced, the VRA is informed and the shooter can shoot unsupervised. Have you had a different experience?

Alan

Yes Alan

AlanF
Posts: 6973
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2005 8:22 pm
Location: Maffra, Vic

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#244 Postby AlanF » Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:05 am

Norm wrote:
AlanF wrote:Norm,

Some of our recent members have been able to join the VRA prior to having a Shooters Licence on the understanding that they need the membership as a "reason" to get a Licence. When the Licence is produced, the VRA is informed and the shooter can shoot unsupervised. Have you had a different experience?

Alan

Yes Alan

Hmmm. Almost sounds like it depends on which VRA officer handles it.

Barry Davies
Posts: 1258
Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:11 pm

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#245 Postby Barry Davies » Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:35 am

I cannot find reference in any VRA document that states that a pre-requisite to joinng the VRA is a shooters licence.
The only pre- requisite I can find is that the person must FIRST be a member of a club.
As far as the firearms act is concerned to obtain a shooters licence you must have a good reason -- For sport or Target shooting an acceptable reason is that you must be a member " of an approved shooting CLUB or shooting association."
The way I read that is that it is only necessary to be a member of an approved CLUB to obtain a shooting licence -- then you can join the VRA if you so desire.
In a nutshell, you can be a member of a CLUB without joining the VRA ( you would need to arrange your own insurance ) but you cannot be a member of the VRA without joining a club first.
I expand that to read that SSAA members can join a FB club and partake of club activities without joining the VRA.

johnk
Posts: 2168
Joined: Sun Sep 07, 2008 7:55 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#246 Postby johnk » Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:20 am

Razer wrote:In NSW there is a P650 form which any unlicensed shooter can fill in and sign and then shoot on the range. It is only good for that day and only on the range.

Queensland has a similar legal requirement, and, as has been said before, we don't turn people away, we encourage them: http://www.qldrifle.com/come-and-try

mike H
Posts: 577
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 5:34 pm
Location: JUNEE NSW

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#247 Postby mike H » Mon Jan 09, 2017 9:46 am

Razer wrote:In NSW there is a P650 form which any unlicensed shooter can fill in and sign and then shoot on the range. It is only good for that day and only on the range.
Obviously there has to be a RO or responsible person from the club as the form needs to be filed, just in case!
When Orange Rifle Club had a range and was still in existence, we often used them.
The same form is used at the SSAA rimfire range in Orange to allow unlicensed shooters to try out shooting or to allow a friend to shoot.
It is simple and straightforward.
This alleviates the need to turn unlicensed shooters away which is basically destroying our clubs and depriving them of future members.


It is a good thing,however there is no room for complacency,one on one supervision is required.

Norm
Posts: 837
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 10:21 pm
Location: Gippsland, Victoria

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#248 Postby Norm » Mon Jan 09, 2017 11:46 am

AlanF wrote:
Norm wrote:
AlanF wrote:Norm,

Some of our recent members have been able to join the VRA prior to having a Shooters Licence on the understanding that they need the membership as a "reason" to get a Licence. When the Licence is produced, the VRA is informed and the shooter can shoot unsupervised. Have you had a different experience?

Alan

Yes Alan

Hmmm. Almost sounds like it depends on which VRA officer handles it.


Yes that is true but the application form requires a shooters license number.

Norm
Posts: 837
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 10:21 pm
Location: Gippsland, Victoria

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#249 Postby Norm » Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:20 pm

Barry Davies wrote:I cannot find reference in any VRA document that states that a pre-requisite to joinng the VRA is a shooters licence.
The only pre- requisite I can find is that the person must FIRST be a member of a club.
As far as the firearms act is concerned to obtain a shooters licence you must have a good reason -- For sport or Target shooting an acceptable reason is that you must be a member " of an approved shooting CLUB or shooting association."
The way I read that is that it is only necessary to be a member of an approved CLUB to obtain a shooting licence -- then you can join the VRA if you so desire.
In a nutshell, you can be a member of a CLUB without joining the VRA ( you would need to arrange your own insurance ) but you cannot be a member of the VRA without joining a club first.
I expand that to read that SSAA members can join a FB club and partake of club activities without joining the VRA.



Hi Barry, the main sticking word is "Approved". Every club would have to apply to the police to become an "Approved" club. At the moment they are not unless they have specifically applied to be approved. In Victoria it is the VRA that is the Approved organisation not the rifle club unless that rifle clubs has applied for approval as an individual entity.

You cannot simply join a "Facebook only Club". The organisation needs to be on the approved list. Now days however most "approved" organisations recognise the marketing power of Facebook so have a Facebook site to attract new members and to promote a positive message about the shooting sports to the general public that views the site.

Here the process to become a new club member, a person's membership is voted on by the club to be accepted. Then the fee is taken, the application form is filled out by the club treasurer with the persons details and shooters license number. The form and payment is sent off by the treasurer and some months later the person receives their VRA/NRAA membership card and SID number.
This system takes too long!

There are three main parts to obtaining a shooters license.
1 Completing the Firearms Safety course.
2 Genuine reason
3 Police background check.

The Police background check is the appropriate method of checking to see if a person is suitable for holding a firearms license.
The Firearms Safety course can take a few weeks to complete depending on how often the courses are conducted.

We should be very interested in the "Genuine Reason" side of things as this is our marketing tool to obtain new members. We need to deliver a membership card to the applicant within the same time frame that it takes for the Firearms Safety Course to be completed.

If we can't do this then a new shooter will simply join another organisation that offers a superior turn around time. They don't want their application held up.

The best way to do this is to develop an online membership application process that can deliver a membership card to a new shooter within days of paying their membership fee online.

I have been told that "organisational change" would be required for the NRAA and its State Rifle Associations to deliver such a system.

AlanF
Posts: 6973
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2005 8:22 pm
Location: Maffra, Vic

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#250 Postby AlanF » Mon Jan 09, 2017 1:50 pm

Norm,

In my recent experience if you ask for a quick turnaround with membership cards from the VRA, you get it, usually within a week.

johnk
Posts: 2168
Joined: Sun Sep 07, 2008 7:55 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#251 Postby johnk » Mon Jan 09, 2017 2:04 pm

Gee, I'm glad I live in Queensland. Here, the state WLB approves clubs, not the state association, after checking whether they function in a manner consistent with providing a genuine reason. For existing clubs that QRA vouched for, that happened in 1996 or 1997 at the latest. Police's intent then and now was to ensure that providers of target shooting were in fact offering that service on an approved rifle range.

That leaves clubs to act autonomously with respect to potential new members & decide whether or not to welcome them into their club on a case by case basis.

AlanW
Posts: 50
Joined: Fri Jun 25, 2010 9:17 am

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#252 Postby AlanW » Mon Jan 09, 2017 3:10 pm

Norm wrote:
Here the process to become a new club member, a person's membership is voted on by the club to be accepted. Then the fee is taken, the application form is filled out by the club treasurer with the persons details and shooters license number. The form and payment is sent off by the treasurer and some months later the person receives their VRA/NRAA membership card and SID number.
This system takes too long!

.


Norm,

Barry is correct a Firearms Licence is not required to obtain VRA Membership, yes there is a place on the membership form, just leave it blank on the application.
At Lang Lang RC, if the new member wishes to proceed with his Licence application immediately, we provide him/her with a letter on our letter head with the following wording:

"To Whom It May Concern:

This is to certify that Andrew "Surname" is a fully paid up member of the Lang Lang Rifle Club Inc.
His membership incorporates membership of the Victorian Rifle Association.
Andrew’s membership number & card will be issued by the Victorian Rifle Association in due course. In the interim this letter is to serve as proof of membership."

We sign the letter and stamp it with our Incorporation seal, this has always been accepted by the licensing authorities.

Alan Wright

Barry Davies
Posts: 1258
Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:11 pm

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#253 Postby Barry Davies » Mon Jan 09, 2017 3:54 pm

Hi Norm,
My understanding is that any club affiliated with the VRA gains automatic approval from the police.
Any club not affiliated with the VRA must seek their own approval.
It is not mandatory that any shooting club affiliate with the VRA., rather the club is invited to affiliate if the members wish to partake of VRA/NRAA run competitions.
The VRA reserve the right to not accept a club for affiliation, but that does not mean that the club cannot operate as a separate entity providing it has police approval plus all the other necessaries that go with the formation of a shooting club.
The VRA constitution clearly outlines the procedure and requirements for club affiliation.

What Alan says in the post above is correct.

Peter Hulett
Posts: 296
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2005 7:44 pm
Location: Geelong, Victoria

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#254 Postby Peter Hulett » Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:39 pm

Having just renewed my shooter's licence I can confirm that my reason is target shooting and my evidence is membership of the "GEELONG RIFLE CLUB" not the VRA. Barry is correct.
Peter

GrahamW
Posts: 146
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:43 pm
Location: Bathurst, NSW
Contact:

Re: Something Needs to be Done

#255 Postby GrahamW » Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:15 pm

Well, I think this thread is a new record for "longest active topic" and "most number of posts", so I just had to get in on it. 8-)

I hadn't realised just how much variation there was between the state associations in regards to new members joining, or maybe it's just different interpretations to the various states written rules.

In any case...... NSWRA has a Temporary Membership option for the purpose of obtaining your firearms license.

Membership lasts for 3 months (enough time to apply and complete all aspects of obtaining your license) @ a cost of $25.
New shooters can continue to shoot with the club using the P650 exemption while waiting for their license approval.

Once the license is obtained the new member can then pay the balance (pro rated) of membership.
This means if for some reason they are rejected on their license application they won't be out of pocket for the full membership.

It also means that new shooters can jump straight in and start learning while waiting for their license.

I had assumed all states had something similar in place, seems I was far from the correct assumption. 8-/


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