Sorry to hear guys! You all deserve a medal for getting through the trials and tribulations of the last 5 yrs and actually making it to the destination. Many wouldn't appreciate the logistics of that let alone dealing with illness and performing at the highest level at the end of it.
You won day 1 and gave them a hurry up on day 2 so don't think anyone will be counting Australia out the race at future events
F-Class World Championships 2023
Moderator: Mod
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Tim N
- Posts: 1336
- Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2013 8:18 pm
- Location: Branxton NSW
Re: F-Class World Championships 2023
Hi everyone
Thank you for your well wishes and compliments.
Unless you have been involved in such an event there’s no way to convey the intensity involved at this level of competition.
Maybe 3 Kings in a row.
Second time around for me and it wasn’t any easier than the Canada campaign.
Albert and Janene have done an incredible job herding the cats from day one-Thank you very much
The Coaches - Jason, Stuart and Lowell did an incredible job-Thank you all
To my team mates and the support crew it was a privilege doing this trip with you all.
If you are keen to give the next World Championships a go start saving and preparing NOW!
While our sport is an individual pursuit for the most part, to compete with a team on the world stage is an incredible experience.
We are doing a mad pack up this morning then off to a property for a few days of much needed R&R.
Looking forward to getting home again
Thank you for your well wishes and compliments.
Unless you have been involved in such an event there’s no way to convey the intensity involved at this level of competition.
Maybe 3 Kings in a row.
Second time around for me and it wasn’t any easier than the Canada campaign.
Albert and Janene have done an incredible job herding the cats from day one-Thank you very much
The Coaches - Jason, Stuart and Lowell did an incredible job-Thank you all
To my team mates and the support crew it was a privilege doing this trip with you all.
If you are keen to give the next World Championships a go start saving and preparing NOW!
While our sport is an individual pursuit for the most part, to compete with a team on the world stage is an incredible experience.
We are doing a mad pack up this morning then off to a property for a few days of much needed R&R.
Looking forward to getting home again
We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training. Archilochos 680-645 BC
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RAVEN
- Posts: 1978
- Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2005 9:37 pm
- Location: Adelaide South Australia (CTV)
Re: F-Class World Championships 2023
Keep safe Tim enjoy your well-deserved rest.Well done to all the teams
Australia teams is now a force to be reckoned with for sure.
Australian show great results in the individual also
I would like to thank SABU for the work that was put into the posting of results.
We, all felt part of the event back home.
RB
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John T
- Posts: 241
- Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2006 5:42 pm
- Location: Brisbane
Re: F-Class World Championships 2023
HELLO ALL.
Most of us will have read the very good F-Open Team Report. It is most doubtful that any of we onlookers would question its content. It confirms that the effort, application, determination and spirit of this Australian TEAM is the equal, at least, of any which has gone before it.
The Report has shown beyond doubt that committing to and attending any World Championship is not a junket for those with the Oxfords, as some may think. Unless you take joy in meeting a challenge with your very best effort, a WC is no place for you.
A burning question; what happened on Day 2? It is not plausible to suggest that there was a dramatic decline in the performances of the wind coaches or the shooters. This just does not happen in a team that was in P1 at the end of all 4 distances up to the penultimate 800m distance on Day 2.
The Report tells us of nightmarish conditions at 800; the bane of every long range target shooter; a rear fish tail with quick switches. Was it not the same for all 5 Teams?
I have looked at the combined scores at 800 and 900 on Day 1 and on Day 2 for each of the 5 Teams and then compared the results on the brutal Day 2 to Day 1 for each Team.
GREAT BRITAIN Up 7 points
NEW ZEALAND Up 5 points
USA Even
SOUTH AFRICA Down 17 points
AUSTRALIA Down 32 points
Looking at the top 3, it might be thought that GB and NZ were under-prepared and USA was spot on, while SA was out of the park for some reason. Australia seems to have caught a bus to a different game at a different park.
What happened? My guess, equipment. Did the 7-300 WSM develop unexpected, unrecognisable and debilitating fouling? (Remember the .577/450 Martini-Henry at Isandlwana, not too far away.)
Only those on the mound can tell us.
VBR
John T.
6.5.23
Most of us will have read the very good F-Open Team Report. It is most doubtful that any of we onlookers would question its content. It confirms that the effort, application, determination and spirit of this Australian TEAM is the equal, at least, of any which has gone before it.
The Report has shown beyond doubt that committing to and attending any World Championship is not a junket for those with the Oxfords, as some may think. Unless you take joy in meeting a challenge with your very best effort, a WC is no place for you.
A burning question; what happened on Day 2? It is not plausible to suggest that there was a dramatic decline in the performances of the wind coaches or the shooters. This just does not happen in a team that was in P1 at the end of all 4 distances up to the penultimate 800m distance on Day 2.
The Report tells us of nightmarish conditions at 800; the bane of every long range target shooter; a rear fish tail with quick switches. Was it not the same for all 5 Teams?
I have looked at the combined scores at 800 and 900 on Day 1 and on Day 2 for each of the 5 Teams and then compared the results on the brutal Day 2 to Day 1 for each Team.
GREAT BRITAIN Up 7 points
NEW ZEALAND Up 5 points
USA Even
SOUTH AFRICA Down 17 points
AUSTRALIA Down 32 points
Looking at the top 3, it might be thought that GB and NZ were under-prepared and USA was spot on, while SA was out of the park for some reason. Australia seems to have caught a bus to a different game at a different park.
What happened? My guess, equipment. Did the 7-300 WSM develop unexpected, unrecognisable and debilitating fouling? (Remember the .577/450 Martini-Henry at Isandlwana, not too far away.)
Only those on the mound can tell us.
VBR
John T.
6.5.23
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willow
- Posts: 568
- Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2015 9:51 pm
Re: F-Class World Championships 2023
John T wrote:HELLO ALL.
Most of us will have read the very good F-Open Team Report. It is most doubtful that any of we onlookers would question its content. It confirms that the effort, application, determination and spirit of this Australian TEAM is the equal, at least, of any which has gone before it.
The Report has shown beyond doubt that committing to and attending any World Championship is not a junket for those with the Oxfords, as some may think. Unless you take joy in meeting a challenge with your very best effort, a WC is no place for you.
A burning question; what happened on Day 2? It is not plausible to suggest that there was a dramatic decline in the performances of the wind coaches or the shooters. This just does not happen in a team that was in P1 at the end of all 4 distances up to the penultimate 800m distance on Day 2.
The Report tells us of nightmarish conditions at 800; the bane of every long range target shooter; a rear fish tail with quick switches. Was it not the same for all 5 Teams?
I have looked at the combined scores at 800 and 900 on Day 1 and on Day 2 for each of the 5 Teams and then compared the results on the brutal Day 2 to Day 1 for each Team.
GREAT BRITAIN Up 7 points
NEW ZEALAND Up 5 points
USA Even
SOUTH AFRICA Down 17 points
AUSTRALIA Down 32 points
Looking at the top 3, it might be thought that GB and NZ were under-prepared and USA was spot on, while SA was out of the park for some reason. Australia seems to have caught a bus to a different game at a different park.
What happened? My guess, equipment. Did the 7-300 WSM develop unexpected, unrecognisable and debilitating fouling? (Remember the .577/450 Martini-Henry at Isandlwana, not too far away.)
Only those on the mound can tell us.
VBR
John T.
6.5.23
It wasn't equipment.
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jasmay
- Posts: 1295
- Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:26 pm
Re: F-Class World Championships 2023
It’s truly great to see the depth of interest in the performance of our Australian teams, this is a great indication our sport is alive and well.
Interest and conversation is good, but as a member and coach of the recent team I would say that some commentary has been made which could come across to some as disparaging towards the team, we must be careful for a number of reasons.
Without intimate knowledge and in depth analysis of the details of the event in a granular way, commentary around what occurred is nothing but assumption, assumption are rumors that can impact on our sport in a negative way.
Having too much open dialogue that is assumption based is likely to impact on future teams, we must be careful & respectful.
Most team members are likely willing to have a conversation, I’d suggest people reach out and do that. However, many team members will not have the whole picture on all aspects of what went right and what went wrong, these analysis often arrive sometime post event after high level analysis.
These points are important, however, the most important is the element of development for the next team and preparing the next suite of tools and tactics that will be used to compete again for the title, we definitely do not want granular analysis in the open for our competition to learn from.
To those that are interested, I would say, in this open forum, that the team performed as a world class outfit, this now been my 4th Australian team I would also say that this team was indeed one of the most well functioning at all levels I have seen to date, this was shown in the fact that this team led the field in for 4 out of 6 ranges, achieving this does not happen by chance competing at this level.
There was no individual element which caused the team to fall behind in the last 2 ranges and this has been analyzed in depth with a view to correcting for the next campaign.
Interest and conversation is good, but as a member and coach of the recent team I would say that some commentary has been made which could come across to some as disparaging towards the team, we must be careful for a number of reasons.
Without intimate knowledge and in depth analysis of the details of the event in a granular way, commentary around what occurred is nothing but assumption, assumption are rumors that can impact on our sport in a negative way.
Having too much open dialogue that is assumption based is likely to impact on future teams, we must be careful & respectful.
Most team members are likely willing to have a conversation, I’d suggest people reach out and do that. However, many team members will not have the whole picture on all aspects of what went right and what went wrong, these analysis often arrive sometime post event after high level analysis.
These points are important, however, the most important is the element of development for the next team and preparing the next suite of tools and tactics that will be used to compete again for the title, we definitely do not want granular analysis in the open for our competition to learn from.
To those that are interested, I would say, in this open forum, that the team performed as a world class outfit, this now been my 4th Australian team I would also say that this team was indeed one of the most well functioning at all levels I have seen to date, this was shown in the fact that this team led the field in for 4 out of 6 ranges, achieving this does not happen by chance competing at this level.
There was no individual element which caused the team to fall behind in the last 2 ranges and this has been analyzed in depth with a view to correcting for the next campaign.
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John T
- Posts: 241
- Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2006 5:42 pm
- Location: Brisbane
Re: F-Class World Championships 2023
Hello Willow and Jason.
Willow, it may be that your comment that "It wasn't equipment' is the target of Jason's statement that " some commentary has been made which could come across to some as disparaging towards the team." If you know that "it wasn't equipment", what was it? Please respond in broad terms only, nothing granular.
Jason, I agree that assumption-based commentary, as opposed to information-seeking, is rarely productive. You, and others, have information that, if shared, will dispatch assumptions and speculations. By all means, leave all that is granular in the silo, but be assured, never can there be any doubt, that the Team is OBLIGED to give an account, albeit succinct, of the disasters at 800m and 900m on Day 2.
And please, do not fall back on the schoolboy theme of keeping it all a secret from the competition. They don't care!
But every aspiring F Open competitor in Australia does.
History abounds in examples of adverse consequences when secrecy is chosen and openness is denied.
VBR
John Tracey.
14.5.23
Willow, it may be that your comment that "It wasn't equipment' is the target of Jason's statement that " some commentary has been made which could come across to some as disparaging towards the team." If you know that "it wasn't equipment", what was it? Please respond in broad terms only, nothing granular.
Jason, I agree that assumption-based commentary, as opposed to information-seeking, is rarely productive. You, and others, have information that, if shared, will dispatch assumptions and speculations. By all means, leave all that is granular in the silo, but be assured, never can there be any doubt, that the Team is OBLIGED to give an account, albeit succinct, of the disasters at 800m and 900m on Day 2.
And please, do not fall back on the schoolboy theme of keeping it all a secret from the competition. They don't care!
But every aspiring F Open competitor in Australia does.
History abounds in examples of adverse consequences when secrecy is chosen and openness is denied.
VBR
John Tracey.
14.5.23
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Azzopardi
- Posts: 62
- Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 1:32 pm
- Location: Cairns, QLD
Re: F-Class World Championships 2023
Willow and John,
A smart person would know that the public forum is not the place to dissect the F-Open team. Do you see an Olympic team submitting a public paper on the public forum or national paper of their performance and technical approach; of course not. That info is passed on at a high level.
The past two teams did not go through the ups and downs, it’s definitely on, then it’s not, then it maybe, it’s on again, it’s not looking good due to a world wide pandemic; their on the plan to SA but it’s not 100% their able to compete, so on and so forth. Members having to resign and new people coming in at the last minute. One could load over there to suit the conditions because it was impossible to have primers and powder available. The fact is, the team fought the negative comments, the ups and downs, the logistic nightmare of SA and came home with a medal. According to eyewitnesses from many countries that were at all 3 of the last world championships, the weather conditions were worse and brutal at SA and, the teams score was higher the the last two gold medal teams.
Any whoo, since I’m the last person to be PC, why don’t you both have a positive approach, put your names down for the next world team and shown us all how it’s done.
Now I’ll sit back a wait for your large words of criticism or wisdom, either or, I don’t care……just saying.
A smart person would know that the public forum is not the place to dissect the F-Open team. Do you see an Olympic team submitting a public paper on the public forum or national paper of their performance and technical approach; of course not. That info is passed on at a high level.
The past two teams did not go through the ups and downs, it’s definitely on, then it’s not, then it maybe, it’s on again, it’s not looking good due to a world wide pandemic; their on the plan to SA but it’s not 100% their able to compete, so on and so forth. Members having to resign and new people coming in at the last minute. One could load over there to suit the conditions because it was impossible to have primers and powder available. The fact is, the team fought the negative comments, the ups and downs, the logistic nightmare of SA and came home with a medal. According to eyewitnesses from many countries that were at all 3 of the last world championships, the weather conditions were worse and brutal at SA and, the teams score was higher the the last two gold medal teams.
Any whoo, since I’m the last person to be PC, why don’t you both have a positive approach, put your names down for the next world team and shown us all how it’s done.
Now I’ll sit back a wait for your large words of criticism or wisdom, either or, I don’t care……just saying.
Regards,
Azzo
Azzo
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AlanF
- Posts: 7500
- Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2005 8:22 pm
- Location: Maffra, Vic
Re: F-Class World Championships 2023
Our sport is not like some others where armchair "experts" can rate team and individual performances, demand answers about why your team lost, call for the heads of coaches etc. One reason is that its not a professional sport. Another is that if you aren't actually there and involved in what's going on, you can only guess. So probably the best we can hope for is for the Captains to issue public statements about their respective team performances, which include a list of the positives, and also a list of things that will need to be worked on for the next FCWC.
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jasmay
- Posts: 1295
- Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:26 pm
Re: F-Class World Championships 2023
Incase some missed it, there was a captains report released.
https://nraa.com.au/nraa-news/australia ... th-africa/
https://nraa.com.au/nraa-news/australia ... th-africa/
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GrahamW
- Posts: 182
- Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:43 pm
- Location: Bathurst, NSW
- Contact:
Re: F-Class World Championships 2023
Thanks Jason,
Great report, that should cover any questions.
Great report, that should cover any questions.
jasmay wrote:Incase some missed it, there was a captains report released.
https://nraa.com.au/nraa-news/australia ... th-africa/
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BATattack
- Posts: 1280
- Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2008 10:29 pm
Re: F-Class World Championships 2023
John T put your hand up for Bisley, take your 300 SAUM imp, about $50k of your own cash and see what it takes.
Part of the Aus team ethos is to operate as a TEAM and accept results as such. So doubtful you will see information that could break that approach.
Part of the Aus team ethos is to operate as a TEAM and accept results as such. So doubtful you will see information that could break that approach.
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