2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

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MR.Sako
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Joined: Mon May 23, 2016 7:19 am
Location: Grafton Rifle Club

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#16 Postby MR.Sako » Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:50 pm

5 shots if i recall 4 of which were the same velocity and im unsure if he has repeated it

bruce moulds
Posts: 2900
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2005 4:07 pm

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#17 Postby bruce moulds » Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:24 am

how meaningful is that?
keep safe,
bruce.
"SUCH IS LIFE" Edward Kelly 11 nov 1880
http://youtu.be/YRaRCCZjdTM

Wal86
Posts: 319
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:10 pm

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#18 Postby Wal86 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:50 pm

I've never thought ES or SD was important.. I reckon its all BS

Oh and save your time and barrel, i wouldn't recommend 2209 with 155.5gr bergers,
Cheers

Brad Y
Posts: 2181
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 8:21 pm

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#19 Postby Brad Y » Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:45 pm

Wal86 wrote:I've never thought ES or SD was important.. I reckon its all BS

Oh and save your time and barrel, i wouldn't recommend 2209 with 155.5gr bergers,
Cheers


There is direct relation between velocity and poi on target at long range. Very easy to see with a chronograph.

DenisA
Posts: 1526
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2011 7:00 pm
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#20 Postby DenisA » Wed Feb 14, 2018 8:58 am

Wal86 wrote:I've never thought ES or SD was important.. I reckon its all BS



Hahahaha, Them's fight'n words! :lol: :lol:

Not on their own, but in conjunction with group size and shape they are. The only time I've seen a justifiable disregard for them is in short range BR.

That's a bold statement to make in a long range shooting community. Your view is contrary to a lot of smart people, a lot of smart testing, over a lot of time with a lot of money that has contributed to result in an extreme standard of long range competition now compared to as little as 10 years ago.

williada
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Joined: Wed Jul 22, 2009 12:37 am

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#21 Postby williada » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:23 pm

Wal86 is just tugging your chains, boys. Good one Wal. [-X

Bigtravoz
Posts: 293
Joined: Sat Apr 22, 2017 7:43 pm

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#22 Postby Bigtravoz » Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:44 am

Neck that 308 down to 6mm and suddenly 2209 becomes a prospect!

David B
Posts: 111
Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2009 10:31 am

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#23 Postby David B » Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:53 am

Bigtravoz wrote:Neck that 308 down to 6mm and suddenly 2209 becomes a prospect!

Then blow it out to 40 Deg shoulder

Bigtravoz
Posts: 293
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Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#24 Postby Bigtravoz » Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:19 pm

David B wrote:
Bigtravoz wrote:Neck that 308 down to 6mm and suddenly 2209 becomes a prospect!

Then blow it out to 40 Deg shoulder

Nothing wrong with the standard specs. Try an 85 grain Sierra gkhpbt over 44 grains of 2209, it’s quite spectacular! Stops lots of critters in their tracks at quite good ranges.

Wal86
Posts: 319
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:10 pm

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#25 Postby Wal86 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:01 pm

No chain tugging here.. ES and SD means bugger all... And that's all ill say in regards to the matter..

Had a reasonable 1000y heavy BR rifle, have a target at home shot in competition at canberra 9 of 10 shots can nearly be covered by the end of a Coke can...(6 of those are all cutting one another)
Load had an ES of 27fps over 10 shots..
Cheers

Gyro
Posts: 764
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:44 pm
Location: New Zealand

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#26 Postby Gyro » Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:13 pm

Wal86 wrote:No chain tugging here.. ES and SD means bugger all... And that's all ill say in regards to the matter..

Had a reasonable 1000y heavy BR rifle, have a target at home shot in competition at canberra 9 of 10 shots can nearly be covered by the end of a Coke can...(6 of those are all cutting one another)
Load had an ES of 27fps over 10 shots..
Cheers


Wal thats heresy and could get you burned at the stake !!!

Buggered if I know the truth or otherwise in your post but what I have always suspected is that there's an awful lot of 'folklore ' in this game. There's just so many variables. Keeps me thinking though as I keep working at understanding this hobby.

Wal86
Posts: 319
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:10 pm

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#27 Postby Wal86 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:34 pm

Gyro,

Dont know what your implying but information in post is true and correct.. Target at the time was an Australian record target at 1000y shot blind..(shots were not marked) Unfortunately the one shot was out.
ES 27fps

I understand its all about eliminating variables but this is one variable that for me, never equates to the full potential of the rifles accuracy..
Cheers
Last edited by Wal86 on Mon Feb 26, 2018 6:08 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Gyro
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Location: New Zealand

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#28 Postby Gyro » Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:54 pm

I'm just teasing ya wal !

I totally believe u and your story. It just adds more mystery to the game that's all. Regards Rob Kerridge

bruce moulds
Posts: 2900
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2005 4:07 pm

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#29 Postby bruce moulds » Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:45 pm

here's what some of the the old dead guys did.
some of you might have seen falling block (also rolling block) breech loading target rifles with false muzzles.
the reason they had false muzzles was to muzzle load projectiles with great straightness, and these false muzzles had a leverage system to virtually swage the bullet into the rifling.
among the reasons for this was insufficient case capacity , so they chambered a primed case, and droptubed powder down the barrel, more than the case could hold.
old writings advised against forgetting to chamber the case prior to charging the powder.
fitting a false muzzle to a 308 would allow higher charges of 2209 or even 2217, to be poured down the barrel, thus increasing the charge to 30/06 imp, 300 wsm, or even the 300 weatherby.
then muzzle load the projectile.
this would totally redefine the 308.
and there seems to be no rule against this technique.
of course this method would not suit machine gunning.
might just be easier to rechamber to 30/06 ackley and shoot open.
keep safe,
bruce.
"SUCH IS LIFE" Edward Kelly 11 nov 1880

http://youtu.be/YRaRCCZjdTM

KHGS
Posts: 934
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 12:46 am
Location: Cowra NSW

Re: 2209 with 30 cal 155.5 Bergers

#30 Postby KHGS » Tue Feb 27, 2018 7:20 am

Wal86 wrote:No chain tugging here.. ES and SD means bugger all... And that's all ill say in regards to the matter..

Had a reasonable 1000y heavy BR rifle, have a target at home shot in competition at canberra 9 of 10 shots can nearly be covered by the end of a Coke can...(6 of those are all cutting one another)
Load had an ES of 27fps over 10 shots..
Cheers


Wal, I tend to agree with you. I believe too much importance is put on ES by the "experts", having said that I do not ignore it, I have parameters I adhere to for all ranges. I like an ES under 30 fps at the longs (past 600 yds), but I find 50 fps acceptable up to 600 yds. I came to this conclusion years ago when I shot a lot of Match Rifle. I found through a lot of chronographing that ES's below 30 fps will stay well in the bull at 1200 yds (this was with 185 grn Berger VLD .308). I do not remember who it was, but someone reputable did some testing with 2 chronographs years ago & found that the ES measured at the muzzle was higher than it was at 1000 yds which is bourn out in my (unscientific) testing & your experiences. I have noticed (very small test sample) that the 125 yd ES is lower than the muzzle ES measured with my Labrada. All inconclusive, but interesting & my F-Open groups stay inside the 6 ring at 1000 if I do my part (wind aside of course)!!!!
Keith H.


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