OzFclass

how many times have i heard a scorer say "9 on" & the shooter say "but i've fired 10." this is usually followed by a great discussion usually involving despondent language. sometimes, the shooter even feels that he or she might have won.
the solution to this problem is simple.
it is the shooter's responsibility to make sure the scorer has correctly recorded the shot. ssr says that if another shot is fired, the unrecorded one does not exist.
my advice is to instruct the scorer to say "one away" when the shot is fired, and "one on" when the target appears without a miss. (three on etc, whatever the shot no is.) should the shooter not be able to hear the scorer, it is important to diplomatically make this clear.
the rules are clear, and protect the shooter who takes responsibility for themselves. use them to your advantage.
hope this helps some new shooters.
bruce moulds.

he he

I find it less distracting to just note my own scores and correct the scorer afterwards than have them chattering away in the background for every shot.

A scorer missing shots through a good condition could be considered cheating... How is that addressed in the rules? How does that protect the shooter who has to break concentration and possibly miss a condition to chase up a scorer?

For most things though you need to determine what works for you and your club and go with that.

M12LRPV,
That may well be an accepted procedure at club level, but you can be assured you would not get away with it at a Queens. If the Scorer and check scorer agree ( and you do not agree with them ), you would have very little chance of winning an argument.
The rules on scoring are ( supprisingly ) very clear. Both scorers AND shooter have equal responsibility to ensure each shot is clearly called and correctly noted--not much use trying to argue about shot # 4 or whatever when all ten shots have been fired AND the two scorers agree. If a scorer misses a shot and you loose your concentration, sorry but you just have to wear it as it was your responsibility to listen for the call. About all you can protest about is the laxity of the scorers.
No doubt they will be very attentative from then on but in all probability the damage has been done---Your responsibility.
Barry

Barry Davies wrote:M12LRPV,
That may well be an accepted procedure at club level, but you can be assured you would not get away with it at a Queens. If the Scorer and check scorer agree ( and you do not agree with them ), you would have very little chance of winning an argument.
The rules on scoring are ( supprisingly ) very clear. Both scorers AND shooter have equal responsibility to ensure each shot is clearly called and correctly noted--not much use trying to argue about shot # 4 or whatever when all ten shots have been fired AND the two scorers agree. If a scorer misses a shot and you loose your concentration, sorry but you just have to wear it as it was your responsibility to listen for the call. About all you can protest about is the laxity of the scorers.
No doubt they will be very attentative from then on but in all probability the damage has been done---Your responsibility.
Barry

Who said anything about getting away with it at the queens.

If the scorer is stuffing around at the queens it would be tantamount to cheating. But that's why there's a check scorer isn't it

M12LRPV,

You're missing the point. The SSRs require the scorer to call the shot & the check scorer to confirm it by returm call & both record the results. Whether you prefer it or not, the scorer is required to ensure that the check scorer agrees with his valuation of a shot & the process to achieve that is to call the shot number & value.

Your participation is required so that you can avail yourself of the options for a value that you believe has been recorded incorrectly - by the value semaphored or the value called or by apparent omission to call the value.

johnk wrote:M12LRPV,

You're missing the point. The SSRs require the scorer to call the shot & the check scorer to confirm it by returm call & both record the results. Whether you prefer it or not, the scorer is required to ensure that the check scorer agrees with his valuation of a shot & the process to achieve that is to call the shot number & value.

Your participation is required so that you can avail yourself of the options for a value that you believe has been recorded incorrectly - by the value semaphored or the value called or by apparent omission to call the value.

Not missing the point. It would seem that i'm very much aware of the issues here.

For instance how does the current system and rules take into account that half the shooting population is deaf?

the place to practise for a prize shoot is at the club.
good habits developed there become useful habits and not conscious thoughts under pressure.
this is the place to learn to ask scorers to get it right (do their job) and learn not to feel guilty, for controlling your own destiny.
bruce moulds.

More than half perhaps.

Some are even visually deaf.

The main problem with hearing difficulties is when the RO or scorer is attempting to instruct the shooter, particularly where a safety issue is involved. I remember a few years back yelling ceasefire at the shooter I was scoring for. Knowing he was partially deaf, I then went up to the shooter and asked if he understood, and received a nod in the affirmative. Ten seconds later, bang! Since then, I make it my business to watch and wait for the bolt to be removed.

But regarding missed shots by the scorer, if a hearing impaired shooter has difficulty hearing the scorer, it is still their responsibility to ensure that they can hear (or be informed by some other means) what the scorer says.

Alan

AlanF wrote:The main problem with hearing difficulties is when the RO or scorer is attempting to instruct the shooter, particularly where a safety issue is involved. I remember a few years back yelling ceasefire at the shooter I was scoring for. Knowing he was partially deaf, I then went up to the shooter and asked if he understood, and received a nod in the affirmative. Ten seconds later, bang! Since then, I make it my business to watch and wait for the bolt to be removed.

But regarding missed shots by the scorer, if a hearing impaired shooter has difficulty hearing the scorer, it is still their responsibility to ensure that they can hear (or be informed by some other means) what the scorer says.

Alan

Absolutely. As situations like that crop up it's necessary to adapt to them and not all situations we encounter have easy solutions.

I know I try to call out each shot load and clear, such as "4 away, target 7" "followed by "6, on target 7" to let them know that I have seen them fire the shot, and to let them know I have seen the score, just in case one of us messes up. I am as guilty as anyone of messing up scoring, but calling out the shots fired, and score has on a few occaisions, had the shooter, or other scorer correcting my mistake quick smart.


I know if I am firing, and I get a good score, if they dont call it out, I call it out aload, so they can hear what I,m saying. Why is it though, that when I get a bad shot, they never miss it?

Something I have started to do is use electronic ear muffs turned up high, with the mic pointed backwards. This way I can hear them loud and clear behind me.

Being one of those deaf old bastards I some time ago bought a set of electronic ear muffs so that in team shoots the coach didn't have to keep poking me to fire . I then found out how useful they were to hear all the ribald remarks that floated out from the shooters behind the mound Still don't hear all the shots called out for the simple reason the scorers are too busy chatting, and it is they who often miss a shot Was in a coached shoot in Sydney,had fresh box of ammo, 12 empty cases later the scorer and check scorer both said we had 1 to go. just had to accept it and fire a 13th.In spite of the obvious evidence [brass and coaches plot sheet]the RO supported them You just hope that it doesn't happen in too often.
Ray.

Ray,

It's the pitz, but once again, it's your obligation (your coach's in that case) to ensure that your shots are scored. Likewise, it's your perogative to have the RO give them a rocket if they're buggarising around.

I understand that most shooters are reluctant to tip on their fellow competitors, but if they are happy to flaunt their obligations, you're only pandering to them to your own detriment by letting them get away with it. Wearing my RO cap, there's not all that many serial offenders around the traps these days, what with TR & F all in, but those blatent offenders need to be sorted out one way or another.

John