Lightweight rifle project

[Woody_rod]

Hello all,

I was going to post this in the fullbore section, but it might be of general interest:

I have been thinking about what is available in rifles, and where our sport is heading with regards to rifle design and weights etc. This is in conjunction with tempting younger shooters (young teens), and more women into our sport (in AU, but otherwise everywhere else).

My son has expressed some interest in shooting with a sling (i.e., TR), and so have some other young shooters (in the 12 to 15 age group). Some women have also either had a go, or said they would do so, but with one major problem - the weight of the rifle. Given that the 223R is now a fairly well accepted cartidge, even at Queens events, it makes sense to make the most use of this...

What I am getting at, is I have an idea of going the opposite direction with rifle weight, given the above scenario (a strength issue), am now thinking of building a rifle in 223R, with lightweight 30 inch barrel, but keep the weight down to about 4.5 kilos. Given that the very light recoil of the 223 is a major advantage, and in this case, a necessity, it is ideal for this idea.

The rifle will be built using our own CG design Aluminium action, weighing much less than the typical unit (about 1.5 kilos), but in the same general dimensions (38mm diameter and about 190mm long). The stock will need to be a very light one, but at a smaller size requirement, this should be easier to achieve.

I think it a bit silly really to make junior shooters wait until they are strong enough for either the recoil, or just lifting the weight of a "grown up" rifle, before they can shoot with them. At the moment, this is what happens at our local range, and guess that this is typical. The other scenario is for the shooters to go into F class, which is great also, but not everyone wants to....

Suggestions, ideas? Sensible, positive replies only please.

[AlanF]

Rod,

I'm not sure how big a market there would be for a lightweight 223 action. Maybe clubs would buy one for new shooters. It is very hard to get young shooters into this sport. The SSAA does much better than us because kids prefer to shoot animals over targets. I'm resigned to accepting that our main recruiting source is in the 40 to 60 years age group who have used guns earlier in life. Our main priority with the teens should be to give them a taste of the sport so they might come back later. Some would say that small-bore is the best option for teens - ammo is cheap, and its often run on week nights (i.e. better to miss some homework than take up valuable weekend time !). Were actually intending to get small-bore going on the range concurrently with FB and F-Class. But it won't be so much a recruitment effort as a long term investment.

Alan

[RAVEN]

Hi woody
any thing that you can do to encourage new and especially young shooter to the sport is a move in the right direction build ya rat gun and see how popular it becomes.

Alan
SSAA is more successful because they have junior programs that young ppl can be apart of what junior programs are promoted by the national body or the stare body for that matter you can only reap what you sow?????
If these programs are in place I am not aware of them and would be glad to hear from ppl or clubs that are running sucsessful junior programs.
Cheers
RB

[AlanF]

Richard,

We run an annual inter-secondary schools shoot - this year 8 teams of 5. It can involve a few practice shoots as well. But I don't remember a single kid from those shoots joining a club. If we do get kids joining its usually because one or both parents are members i.e. they get a ride to the range and get their costs paid. Unfortunately there's a huge choice of much easier things for kids to do.

If they enjoy what the SSAA provides, I say let them go for it. We'll get them later when they grow up and their own kids are off their hands and they have Saturdays free again . We get one or two a month drop in to have a look, and if we can just get them to try one of the club F-Class rifles, chances are they'll be hooked!

Alan

[RAVEN]

That’s great Alan we are patient ppl

[Woody_rod]

So far, the comments are right on what we are experiencing at club level.

Smallbore is a great idea, but one that doesnt really fit into shooting on the range with the "grown ups", which is what I would like to see....(I have started to shoot smallbore as practice for fullbore.)

The idea is not really from a sales point of view, maybe I should have made that clear. Really just an idea for development, taking into account the issues faced.

On asking my 12yo boy tonight about what he would rather shoot - f class or with a sling, he said the same as me (TR), which I pretty much guessed. So, to get him shooting with a sling, we either have to build a rifle specifically for him (and people of his size/age), or use another type of rifle, such as a hunting type rifle converted to TR (say a lightweight Tikka in 223R), with adaptations for sling rail, peep sights etc.

I suppose this is a practical thought process, and not so much a philosophical one about what clubs should do, but whether the idea of a lighter rifle would make the progression of younger shooters into our sport faster or easier???

[ned kelly]

G'Day Woody,
well there is an old saying along the lines of build a better mouse trap and they will knock you door down to buy it........or some such.

Great idea, consider using a barrel tuner where rules allow (F class) as the rimfires with thin parallel barrels work great with tuners. Build it as a "system" where it can evolve as the shooter's needs change such as heavier barrels can be added, optional bolts (bolt heads) for 308/6BR, spacers to increase length of pull as the kids grow. Maybe a weight system as well to keep it all "balanced" as you change the configuration. Different trigger options by using trigger adapter hangers (maybe). Integral full length tapered weaver style bases.

Just some quick ideas; discard as you see fit...........

Cheerio Ned

[Woody_rod]

Thanks Ned,

You are right on the money with your ideas.

So far, I had intended to have an intregral rail (easy enough), and very likley an aluminium stock, that can be simply adjusted out as required. Your idea about weights and balances is a good one....as this will change as the rifle changes, thanks.

[ned kelly]

G'day Rod,
No worries mate!
Cheerio Ned

[bennf]

Hi Woody
I have just purchased a CNC machining centre (for my core business) and a couple of us are looking at a mass produced infinately variable stock on the side.
It would be Alum with adjustable grip, cheek, & but plate options.
V Block bedding, bolt on forend grips for f class and TR.
We came up with this idea to try and get new shooters into better equipment cheaper. When I say better I mean better fitting. you could still use an old omark but have a stock that fits you well.
Currently these type of stocks are for the rich but I am hoping with a lot of help to build these things on the cheap.
It might well fit into your idea.

Benn Farrawell

[Woody_rod]

bennf,

PM me on what your intentions are for the stock. We have a Mazak SQT15MS for making rifle actions (an overkill, but overkill is just right in my book...).