Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

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Tim N
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Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#1 Postby Tim N » Thu Feb 11, 2016 7:50 am

Hi All,
As you may already know, the individual world championships in Canada 2017 will be shot Bisley style.
I realise that there is only a handful of people from OZ who will likely compete in this comp, but as a variation and to help these chosen few I think a target set aside (at state queens) for those who wish to shoot bisley would be of great benefit, still be part of the comp and experience the pressure etc.
Might also just be fun for those who wish to try it for a change.
Just thought I'd throw it out there.
We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training. Archilochos 680-645 BC

williada
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Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#2 Postby williada » Thu Feb 11, 2016 10:24 am

Tim, if that is the case, then may I advise the timeframe between shots in your load development match timeframe you expect to lay on the mound between shots. This will optimise the harmony in your nodal tunes. David.

johnk
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Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#3 Postby johnk » Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:44 pm

Of course, if you're shooting with somebody like me who occasionally likes to mindf*** the other guy by shooting in a way that busts his chosen cadence.....

williada
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Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#4 Postby williada » Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:28 pm

Yes John, we have to rely on guile and cunning as we age and of course tell stories.

I am reminded of a young shooter who got into a shoot-off some years ago and was pitted against one of the best shots in the land. The older gent gets his shot off first and comes up with a beautiful centre first sighter. The young bloke shoots and comes up with a bull. The old bloke pauses on his second sighter and the young bloke gets a V bull. The old bloke let's go a perfect 4 at 3 o'clock for his second sighter. The young then plants a 4 at 9 o'clock. The old bloke plants another centre first business. The rest is history. The young bloke had altered his sight thinking the old bloke was a top shot and thought there was something in the condition. He did not have confidence in his own ability to read conditions. The old bloke deliberately paused to game him and then played with a sighter which did not count. There was no wind change but a deliberate wind of the sight by the older guy to suck the young bloke in.

So with this Bisley style it is more important to watch the elevation pulse on the day than to watch windage. If electronic targets are used, well your are on your own anyway.

ShaneG
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Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#5 Postby ShaneG » Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:50 pm

Tim
I think you have a great idea here.
Just occasionally I let my thinking out of the box!?

Why not have the organisers of any Queens in future ask if we want to shoot Bisley?
And pair us accordingly?
But PLEASE pair F Class together not with TR, ??!!

it will work!!
And it will MAKE us better wind readers!

I have 17 rounds experience at it from the Mace Cup at NRAA last year.
But I learnt from even that small experience!
Twice I tried to read off my competitors result and it double dutched me both times!
What I got from that was go on the confidence of your own results and ignore the one you are scoring!
AND I thoroughly enjoyed shooting in that style!

Ultimately Bisley style winners will be the best wind readers!
It messes with machine gunners and condition shooters both!
Good one Tim, let's push this along!
Shane

Barry Davies
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Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#6 Postby Barry Davies » Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:41 pm

In addition it means you will probably have to shoot to the 45 sec rule. No sitting and waiting for a condition to come back--that might upset a few.

Matt P
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Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#7 Postby Matt P » Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:43 pm

Barry Davies wrote:In addition it means you will probably have to shoot to the 45 sec rule. No sitting and waiting for a condition to come back--that might upset a few.

This is where the ET's could work very well, after 45 seconds it scores a miss !!! :D
RO's wouldn't have to time people and so on.
Matt

williada
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Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#8 Postby williada » Thu Feb 11, 2016 7:18 pm

Brilliant Matt, and barrels might last longer too. A little tweaking of the timer and showing on the clock which would have to reflect a continuous 45 second cycle otherwise a few fast shots could unsettle a competitor if his time started when yours finished below the allocated time. Not that we would want to do that. :mrgreen:

jasmay
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Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#9 Postby jasmay » Fri Feb 12, 2016 6:47 am

Matt P wrote:
Barry Davies wrote:In addition it means you will probably have to shoot to the 45 sec rule. No sitting and waiting for a condition to come back--that might upset a few.

This is where the ET's could work very well, after 45 seconds it scores a miss !!! :D
RO's wouldn't have to time people and so on.
Matt


How would we manage disputes, have a button to stop the timer?

AlanF
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Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#10 Postby AlanF » Fri Feb 12, 2016 7:02 am

The worst thing about the 45 second rule is that it can raise the stress levels. I think the best way of handling it is to get into a rhythm of shooting in about 30 to 40 seconds. What makes Bisley style harder is that your partner(s) can upset your rhythm by being erratic with their times.

Tim N
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Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#11 Postby Tim N » Fri Feb 12, 2016 8:38 am

Can someone explain the 45 sec rule?
Is there a fixed time alotted or dose it start after the other person has shot?
How is it policed?
My guess is a timer with a beep set for 30/40 and a buzzer on 45 would let everyone know if someone was going over time, (and probably not allowed.)
We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training. Archilochos 680-645 BC

johnk
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Location: Brisbane

Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#12 Postby johnk » Fri Feb 12, 2016 9:03 am

Where it's shot, the pair or trio score for each other, so a shooter's time starts from when the scoring shooter calls score & the shooter accepts it. As far as the time goes, there are three possibilities that do occur at Bisley:

    A shooter might get upset by the slowness of another shooter & call in the RCO to check in future cases - not a common occurrence.
    The RCO might notice a slow pair or trio & run the stop watch on them.
    Markers are a feisty lot at Bisley & are quite likely to report slow shooting t6o the RCO.

We once had 45 second shooting here for all matches, but the reluctance of shooters & scorers to comply led us to elapsed time shooting, except in the case of shootoffs where the RO is in direct control of the shoot & can police it effectively.

Tim N
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Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2013 8:18 pm
Location: Branxton NSW

Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#13 Postby Tim N » Fri Feb 12, 2016 9:13 am

I guess some ET systems could score and time competitors?
We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training. Archilochos 680-645 BC

RDavies
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Location: Singleton NSW

Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#14 Postby RDavies » Sat Feb 13, 2016 8:19 am

Tim, when I get my gear back, I will be keen to do some Bisley style shooting with you at Cessnock. I'm pretty sure Lewis and Dave are keen as well. No doubt there will be howls of protest from some dinosaurs but we can just pair up and share an ET together to get use to it. It wont be the same as doing it on manual targets, but will be a start.
I wonder if some of the open prize meetings around here could be talked into holding at least one range of Bisley style at the end of the day? I also hope that something like the Mace cup at Belmont (15 shots Bisley style at the end of competition) could be copied for a few more Queens. Even without the FCWC using it, it still makes for some variety.

BATattack
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Re: Prepare to shoot Bisley for Canada

#15 Postby BATattack » Sun Mar 06, 2016 8:03 am

We have tried combining it with events in SA and it hasn't gone as smoothly as hoped. As stand alone event it works well but we found it took a LOT longer to work through bisley pairs as most would take nearly their full 45 seconds for every shot.

Having all the bisley shooters on the same target didn't work but it might be worth trying to have one or two pairs per target to spread the extended time evenly.

Once people become more familiar with bisley and speed up their strategies you might see an improvement but pairs will never be as fast as a lot of individuals shoot.


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