question about dies

[macguru]

question about dies:

If you get a redding type s full length resizing die and unscrew the decapping pin and remove the neck sizing collet, are you left with a redding body die ?

In other words, does the redding body sizing die do anything different or better to the case body/shoulder that the type s die does not do exactly the same ??

[Barry Davies]

The type S Full length sizing die is not the same as a Body Die.

Both dies full length size but to different dimensions. Both dies can " Bump " the shoulder.

The " Body Die " will size to a larger body size than a Full Length die.
For example --a fired case ( 308 ) will measure about 0. 454 at the shoulder.
A Full length die will size that back to about 0.447.
A body Die will size that back to about 0.452
So, a body die will work a fired case considerably less than a Full Length die.
Probably the ideal combination of dies is --
A bushing type " Necking Die " --Does not size the body.
Followed by a " Body Die " --sizes body only.
If you want to FLS use a small base die which sizes the body back to new case size ( almost ) but does not neck size --same as a body die only smaller.
Barry

[BRETT B]

I have a few Redding Type S FLS bushing dies and Body dies in the same cartridge and I have seen no difference in the amount they size the case.
I have however seen other full length dies from other manufacturers size a lot different with regards to dimensions..

[KHGS]

I have a few Redding Type S FLS bushing dies and Body dies in the same cartridge and I have seen no difference in the amount they size the case.
I have however seen other full length dies from other manufacturers size a lot different with regards to dimensions..

My findings also. One must remember tolerances, I have seen quite marked variation in sizes of all propriety dies. Barry is right in a general sense, but manufacturing tolerance can result in a reverse order occurring.
Keith H.

[David B]

My dies are the opposite the Body die sizes the base of the case a little more.

[Chopper]

Why do you need a body die ? when an S FL series does the lot ? tight chambers, ? Chop

[macguru]

I think the type s die without the pin and neck collet makes a perfect body die. I am sure that there is a variation between different dies and brands just as there might be with the reamers. I thought my chamber was too tight but i was probably wrong.

There was a small amount of grit <4 thou in the chamber that did not compress or break up, it let the unfired brass enter the chamber with inconsistent pressure but made extraction difficult after it expanded. I bumped the shoulder more than was necessary to try to fix it and then marked up the cases with texta and found the scratches. so i cleaned the chamber with a 12g brush and bore mop. i even took the barrel off for a better look. The same amount of crap would not stop my savage but the barnard bolt design is a bit different. I think i have resolved it, i just have to lift my game a bit with case and chamber cleaning. Ill try it tomorrow but i think i am on the right track.

[Chopper]

From the past , you may have needed them for tight chambers and hot loads, But then the fear of case separation , ? I thought SAAMI specs should solve these variations, But we may not be getting SAAMI spec dies, and I think a few try to sharpen reamers ? so headaches happen , ? Chop

[BRETT B]

Why do you need a body die ? when an S FL series does the lot ? tight chambers, ? Chop

Some prefer to size the case with a body die and then finish with a Lee Collet die to size the neck.

I have used many variants of dies and to my amazement the Body die/ Lee Collet die combo produces the straightest, least run out ammo I can make..

[williada]

Have to agree Brett. Alan we need a like button.

[macguru]

my problems were solved by proper chamber cleaning. I agree that there are times when i might do the body and neck resizing seperately but i have no complaints about the type s dies ....

[Old Trev-39]

Hi All,
I think the die problems stem from varying tolerances in manufacturing different runs. I have a 6.5x55 die set and it produces loaded rounds with a max.of .002 run out. However my .284 set produces loaded rounds with up to .007 run out. Same procedures and press used.
Cheers,
Trevor.

[KHGS]

Why do you need a body die ? when an S FL series does the lot ? tight chambers, ? Chop

Some prefer to size the case with a body die and then finish with a Lee Collet die to size the neck.

I have used many variants of dies and to my amazement the Body die/ Lee Collet die combo produces the straightest, least run out ammo I can make..

Spot on, my formula exactly! Lee make some very good products & some very ordinary products, but the collet die is one of the very best loading tool available, in my opinion.
Keith h.

[JasonO]

Does it make much difference to accuracy, run out or brass life if the body die is small base or standard?
Jason

[DenisA]

A while ago, I played around with a bushless, Redding FLS bushing die and a Redding body die to answer this question. The cartridge was .284W. These cases had been neck turned and donuts reamed, fired 1/2 dozen times and I had previously only been shoulder bumping with a body die, neck sizing 2/3rds of the neck to keep the re-forming donut away from the bullet.

I found that the neck hole ID was slightly larger on the body die which kept it a little further away from the shoulder/neck junction.
The bushless FLS bushing die was a little smaller in the neck hole ID (the land that the bush sits on) and even without the bush it still very slightly touched the base of the neck at the neck/shoulder junction. Because of that it tightened the re-forming donuts and caused them to contact the bullet when seating.
That caused more neck tension than desired and could cause accuracy issues.

I think it was only a problem in that situation and alike because the brass was necked up 6.5-284 Lapua brass which creates donuts almost instantly and they re-form as the thicker brass from the shoulder flows forward.