Bigtravoz wrote:As someone who has seen muzzle brakes in action I can see what the issue is with them, I am far from a dinosaur and am all for trying to get people involved in the sport. The problem with a muzzle brake is how they create blowback in a lateral fashion, on a dry mound this is quite an issue as the dust that is kicked up goes sideways across the mound. Not just dust either in the case of large caliber rifles. I am sure that if you turned up to a range and joe blogs with his $2000 dollar factory rifle started throwing sand dirt and rocks at you and your $10000+ custom action rifle and scope you too wouldn’t be very happy about it. All for the addition of new classes and maybe there could be a separate class shot before or after the main f class shooters have done their thing.
That’s why they move them to the end target with a plywood baffle a few feet to the side of the muzzle.
Pete wrote:Congratulations to Dalby and its members for their successful PRS style match. It is refreshing to see a more enlightened outlook regarding different disciplines, this can only be beneficial in the keeping of our ranges viable. The NRAA REALLY need to get over the muzzle brake issue and as Rod said, just place them down the end of the range or whatever, it can all be worked out. Matt's point regarding the rules is spot on, they are only a rule until replaced with a new and more realistic one, so why doesn't this happen? Seriously, the NRAA wants to keep the sport faithful to its origins, well you can keep doing this and then at your leisure read about it in the books, because chances are the ranges will not have the capital to be run anymore.... Pete
Yes Congratulations to Ddrc and I guess Dalby Rc ! But there is a group of keen individuals lead by Jason ! I wish them all The best ! I hope it’s amicable for all concerned !
Bigtravoz wrote:I am sure that if you turned up to a range and joe blogs with his $2000 dollar factory rifle started throwing sand dirt and rocks at you and your $10000+ custom action rifle and scope you too wouldn’t be very happy about it
As an organiser of practical rifle events allowing muzzle breaks, I can honestly say the average price of rifles on the line...including optics...would be equal to anything you’d find on an F Class firing line. I don’t think these style of comps are necessarily a way to help F Class to grow and most shooters don’t seem to want to get into F class but there is a big market for shooters wanting something like PRS matches. Certainly a possible way of increasing numbers on the range and or utilising ranges more fully.
As an addition to the above also perhaps bolstering the numbers in the club. No need to join the *RA if the compete in another national competition governed by someone else but join the local club that looks after the range maintains the targets ect all money for maintenance.
Being new to f Class and at the age of 34 am hopefully not a dinosaur but I have to say that I have absolutely no interst in shooting PRS. That said what I do have an interst in is the ranges still being open not just in 1, 2, 12 years when my 5 week old son will be able to shoot but hopefully in 40 or 50 years when I will have earnt my position as a range dinosaur. If that means accomoditing PRS then fantastic (who knows it may be my son who wants to shoot it) but it needs to be introduced sympathetically to other range users. From what I have seen on a dirt mound a sheet of plywood is a start but still has issues especially when wind is coming down range. They also seem to deflect sound from the non PRS rifles next to the baffel across the rest of the mound.
In regards to the above I agree totally re sympathetic adoption of new disciplines. F Class was frowned upon by many when it first started (and by some still) and now it is going great guns. There are ways around the muzzle brake issue- we don’t shoot alongside F Class or TR shooters except perhaps for a bit of a practice after all competitive stages have been shot for the day. In the interests of full disclosure, I shoot F Open and F Standard as well as in precision service rifle matches. Even within our own club the precision service rifle comps we run aren’t supported by everyone (even though it is a very small part of the club shooting activities) although any open objection tends to fade away when they see the entry fees being used to fund the purchase of more electronic targets which benefits them.
I'm all for being inclusive of new shooters, and I understand the dinosaur logic... But i dont believe PRS shooters want to participate in fclass, is it more that PRS shooters need ranges to shoot on?
If PRS shooters wanted to shoot fclass, removing the break shouldn't be a problem.. Cheers
Wal86 I think a lot of PRS / PSR type shooters would love the opportunity to practice at the range during F Class matches and NOT be included in the actual scoring of the event because of the brake. You may see that as NOT wishing to participate in pure F Class, due to the score not counting, but it IS still long range shooting, is it not? As for PSR shooters needing ranges to shoot on, obviously they do.... How exactly will this effect clubs, other than making them more financial and viable? As far as just simply removing the brake, please give some thought of how tuning your rifle is performed....... It is interesting to see how some opinions are now once again quickly separating the classes of range users, as if they are over crowded, that actually sharing a range is a matter limited spots. Ever wonder why range fee's need to be so high? And as for separating your fellow shooter due to their choice in equipment, Geez when has that happened before, Full bore and F class perhaps. History does indeed repeat it seems........... Regards Pete
Every new technology or disapline has its teething problems !! Prs and fullbore ( f class - Tr ) coexisting can work and be a huge benifeit for all in the shooting sports if everyone goes on in good will to a common goal or for common good !
As an aside I get a significant POI change on my 223 without/with the brake which is a pain. I have to take it off to shoot at North Arm. It is a minor inconvenience but is frustrating as I reckon I make more dust with my unbraked 308 than my braked 223.
I respect the SSRs and want to avoid any complications for our (fantastic volunteer) ROs so I will keep doing this atm...but eventually I might not use the 223 for FClass.
If PRS appeals to a big enough audience, then one way or another it'll succeed. But I don't think F-Class and TR shooters have an obligation to make way for it, unless there is a convincing argument that we will benefit, or at least not go backwards. An obvious benefit is increasing justification for ranges to stay open, but this isn't a problem for all ranges. Some make good use of the available days and number of targets. Perhaps the increased membership will have benefits in terms of income and volunteer labour, but unless PRS becomes fully recognised in the SSRs as a competition category, then probably not. Currently many ranges operate at a pretty relaxed pace and that suits many of our members, particularly older shooters. Its not going to be easy to slot in large numbers from a new discipline.
I have read all the posts & I personally have no issues with PRS, my question is a simple one, why do we have to evolve???? Perhaps PRS needs to "evolve"???? Please do NOT tell me I have to accept a muzzle braked rifle shooting in the lane next to me without baffleing!!!! Not going to happen!!!! Keith H.
Keith I don’t see the two being shot side by side ever. That doesn’t mean that clubs can’t...possibly...offer another discipline. We organise our shoots under NRAA Service Rifle Rules so there is precedent. I would never expect the two to happen side by side and from my experience they aren’t really compatible to be shot side by side.
! I wish them all The best ! I hope it’s amicable for all concerned !
As an organiser of practical rifle events allowing muzzle breaks, I can honestly say the average price of rifles on the line...including optics...would be equal to anything you’d find on an F Class firing line. 
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