The Future

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Steve N
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Re: The Future

#16 Postby Steve N » Sun Sep 16, 2018 5:47 pm

Tim I hope you do put yourself forward for nomination to the NRAA board and I hope others do too . With three vacancies it is a great opportunity for FClass shooters to get better representation and to get people in that can take the sport forward. Especially important with Bob P resigning.

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Re: The Future

#17 Postby DenisA » Sun Sep 16, 2018 5:58 pm

Aside from the well recognised issues of the associations not doing enough, the members not doing enough and the old guard that are in the right positions not accepting evolution, change and growth, I believe we have another newer major problem.....

There are a few things that people don't agree with at both club PM's and major PM's. One example is target type. The recent notion of "vote with your feet" is contributing to the sports demise. It's not just the reduced number of competitor attendance, but the reduced atmosphere that goes on to effect those that do attend. It detracts from the importance of being there and attending the next one. This is a snowball effect.

"Voting with your feet" doesn't work to encourage positive change when the governing bodies don't care.

The best thing that we can do as members, until the S & T boards are full of the right people is for us to Patron as many local PM's and Queens as possible. Re-build the hype, the atmosphere and the profile of the sport. Give people a reason to want to be involved...………… Because the reasons for wanting to be involved are rapidly diminishing.

For the sport to turn around and flourish, a lot of people would have to make a lot of effort, be open minded and work together. We can't even get that to happen with the people currently involved at any level.

Sadly, in my own mind, I've accepted that the sport won't last and that's not through lack of me trying to be involved. I'm going to enjoy it while I can.

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Re: The Future

#18 Postby MCLE » Sun Sep 16, 2018 6:13 pm

We need change / help most everyone agrees I think the type and degree is where we start heading down different roads ..
I think we need radical change and some I talk to say that as a organisation radical change is never going to happen ...
At some stage we as a organisation had change and for our sport some would of called it Radical change .. We had the introduction of Fclass ..They could of just gone down the easy road and introduce what the rest of the world had and gone with FTR and Fopen ..
But for reasons I don't know about we went our own way . And we now have something
Uniqley Australian F Standard was Bourne it might of been deeply disliked by some but now is the norm ..'
But that was radical thinking back then but we had the stomach to do what needed to be done
Thought outside the box went against what would of been easy and did it .
Our SSRs / Rules should be a living document other sports do for better or worst they tweak them to fit with what works .. Twenty 20 cricket has probably helped save the game for one example .. And cricket is one of the most Traditional sports going around ..
So why not do it again sit down and come up with another uniquey Australian style ..
As l have said l don't think we can help TR and it might be already to late in some states for FC.
But it's probably not too late to build something new something that will save our ranges .
I don't know what that would look like but l do know it looks very little like what we have now . As I think we all agree isn't working..
For me if we never shot another queens again and it was called a state title who cares..
If the state title had muzzle brakes and magazines for example again I wouldn't worry about it .. If this bought more shooters onto the sport of LR shooting and boosted the numbers and helped saved our ranges and kept the sport of LR shooting alive for the next generation then
It would of been worth the hard work ..

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Re: The Future

#19 Postby DenisA » Sun Sep 16, 2018 6:25 pm

It’ll be hard to save what we have under the current S& T, but harder to build something new. I’d say realistically impossible. Where’s all the money and man power going to come from.

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Re: The Future

#20 Postby Rebel105 » Sun Sep 16, 2018 9:53 pm

Can anyone believe this, really,.. F-class trying to solve the problems of the NRAA.
Radical change is needed.. who said that?
Maybe a name change for SSAA & NRAA when they amalgamate so nobody loses face with equal board representation, just maybe shooting as we know it can be saved.

SunnyCoast 5r
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Re: The Future

#21 Postby SunnyCoast 5r » Sun Sep 16, 2018 10:39 pm

As a member of SSAA (worth it for access to many ranges; the excellent magazine; some political clout; etc) and QRA/NRAA (not sure what I get for that other than the discount at the qstore) I cannot see why the SSAA would want to amalgamate?! If they look long-term they can probably just wait and pickup the ranges they want as we slowly disappear....

I still think we could survive if we ‘modernise’ our sport. Archery might provide some clues: they grew their participant numbers by 43% from 2001 to 2016 (Roy Morgan figures via the internet). Their sport is not real cheap at the elite end but I suspect most of their new members just spend a modest amount to get started.

What about a very gradual reduction in the specs and or cost of FSA/B rifles to make it more affordable? Or to favour more out-of-the-box factory rifles?

FOpen and FTR would still be available to those who wish.

Oh, and I propose Fix#1 is change the name from NRAA to something that lets people know we shoot big round targets from a long way AND have nothing to do with the US NRA. As a worker in state education I get asked about this almost every time someone finds out my hobby.

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Re: The Future

#22 Postby scott/r » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:34 am

I may be only reasonably new to fullbore, but in the 5 years I've been shooting t/r at club and Queens shoots, I believe that the numbers have improved. I know in se Queensland, every country range has seen member increase and their prize shoots are showing an increase right across the board. For instance, narc have gone from an average of about 15 shooter a week, since I started, to now we are averaging just over 30. And our prize shoot has gone from just under 60 to 80 last year. We've even had 2 more targets installed since I've started to accommodate the new members. And it's not just us, like I said before, we all are seeing the same growth.
Sunnycoast, you probably wouldn't know half the people we have shooting with us now, so maybe once you get that rifle back from the boofheads in Lithgow, you might be pleasantly surprised by how good we have it here with new members.

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Re: The Future

#23 Postby MCLE » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:12 am

Let's hope your right but unfortunately I don't think so . In some clubs around the country this might be the case .. But nationally I don't believe this is whats happening . We are loosing TR shooters faster than they are joining ..

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Re: The Future

#24 Postby GSells » Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:47 am

I think in Queensland we are ok and are growing. Muzzle breaks are just an issue and service target rules being implemented is our only issue at the moment. All of our opms are going well that I can see.

Barry Davies
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Re: The Future

#25 Postby Barry Davies » Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:50 am

It all starts at club level Mike. The club is the basis for everything. You were not around in the " good old days " ( tongue in cheek ) when clubs were totally active and along with DRA's formed the backbone of the organization.
Today everybody is for themselves -- you reap what you sow.

Tim N
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Re: The Future

#26 Postby Tim N » Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:04 am

I'm a member of the Cessnock club and we often have a good turnout running 5 ETs there's a few blokes who fit into the tactical crowd who are most welcome and shoot for the fun of it, which is what we all should be doing!
My thought is our ranges should be easily accessible to any shooter on a casual basis-ie non members should be able to shoot for a slightly higher charge which is what the ssaa do.
We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training. Archilochos 680-645 BC

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Re: The Future

#27 Postby johno » Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:54 am

Agree totally with Tim N it is the casual shooters that we need to encourage to keep coming back.Take their extra bit of money for range use when they come, hope they come back and bring a mate or two with them.Keep the numbers coming to keep our ranges open.
How can you encourage any shooting discipline if you say to new shooters you can only shoot here a few times then you have to join the state association or you can't shoot here anymore.
Needs to be a lot more flexibility from powers to be regarding welcoming newcomers to the ranges and insurance coverage.

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Re: The Future

#28 Postby pigdog » Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:11 am

There are stacks of hunters/field shooters who would like to use the nraa ranges. I don't shoot F class I'm one of the many people who would like to pay and use your ranges. I have a 700m nraa range 5min drive for my house. Unfortunately I have never shot one round there because of the rules!!!! What a dismal failure and there are many like me in my small town who would like to use the range. Heres why its a failure.

1. No muzzle brakes = fail
2. Must shoot f class or Full bore to use range = fail

That's it those 2 things are why this range is dying (4 active members) hopefully when it dies the ssaa picks it up and all us hunters and field shooters can finally use this great facility. All you need to do is what the north arm rifle club is doing. Let people shoot whatever rifle they want and let them shoot at their own targets in a non competition format. They will pay to use your range and when word gets around that the ranges are allowing this people will come.

Until then myself and many others will continue to shoot on farms (which has its own problems ie noise complaints) until the ssaa take over or the nraa make changes.
Last edited by pigdog on Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Future

#29 Postby AlanF » Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:13 am

DenisA wrote:"...Voting with your feet" doesn't work to encourage positive change when the governing bodies don't care...

That's a fair point Denis. I've been guilty of that myself, but we're now in a situation where we can't afford to have that attitude.

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Re: The Future

#30 Postby DenisA » Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:26 am

There is not just one thing that needs to be fixed or changed to get sport flourishing again.
Bums on seats at club level anyway we can, offer evolved classes, encourage PM attendance, get the right people in the right board and committee seats, etc..
There's so much that needs to be done in so many different areas.

One of the things that I don't like about the current workings of the S & T is the lack of direction given to clubs and members.

No one knows what the S & T's want.... And so when some members try to be pro-active with good ideas, they get smothered and / or don't get support. The S & T should be very clear of the direction it wants to see clubs going in. It should do this through awards, not publications released in an e-magazine that few ever see. Hopefully that might get more people on the same page.

To do this, I would like to see a prestigious annual awards night held at the state Queens. There should be:-

# Financial awards to the top 3 clubs that have had most growth
# Awards to members of those clubs that have contibuted the most
# Awards to the clubs that have had the most members patron other PM's through the year
# Awards to members who have Patroned the most PM's
# Shooter of the year in each class
# Most improved over the year

... and any other worthy awards.

It wouldn't be expensive or hard to do but it would bring about hype, atmosphere and give members that are involved something to really look forward to every year and something to strive towards.
It should be a catered night, maybe black tie, maybe with a live local jazz group or something to that effect. The cost would be covered at the door and as a table price of those invited who have qualified for an award.

To attend a Queens and walk into the stage area of the nights and see no one around leaves me feeling like the prestige of the event is really lacking. We need to build atmosphere and prestige.

Also, I'd like to see councillors more active on social media and such, letting the members know whats going on with S & T's and bridging the gap.

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