My bloody luck

[Brad Y]

So my first foray into 7mm isnt being as easy as one might expect. Ive finally got all the gear sorted and trimmed donuts from cases so they dont affect me, Ive had my barrel recrowned as one land edge got rolled over (my bad) but now I have a 30 inch krieger 5R 1:8.5 twist that is coppering hard from the start of the throat all the way to the crown. Just ticked over 450 rounds today and with a clean barrel (borescoped) it took all of 5 shots to start spraying them. Its the 4th krieger Ive owned (various cals) and none have set the world on fire. Weird thing was I didnt get much copper in the run in of the barrel, now it looks to be a worthwhile investment for Clive Palmer if he ever wants to open a copper mine.

This arvo after returning home from firing those 14 shots Ive used sweets to remove as much copper as possible then gone to iosse paste and cleaned the barrel back to steel again (borescoped) I have also spent a bit of time with the fine pink autosol (not the nasty stuff) on a patch to try and smooth it out. Ive been told the JB bore brite (purple stuff) is supposed to be very good for this too. Obviously it needs to be shot a fair bit and worked on but wondering what else can be done. Is it a candidate for moly coating? Do I need to maybe look at sierras if the berger jackets are too soft? And lastly has anyone had this happen in a 5R barrel? The 5R's are rumoured to possible clean easier and foul a little less and even be slightly faster barrels. So far its taking alot to clean, easy to foul and takes 52.8gr 2209 with a 180 and a jam to get to 2850fps.

At least I dont have to worry about it for tassie, but its still giving me the shits knowing that something isnt right.

[RAVEN]

Brad Y
How do you run in your barrels?
Have you tries some of the better solvents?( it sound like you are doing a lot of scrubbing.
Is it copper or carbon?
Copper is a guiling metal it acts as a lubricant so some in the barrel is a good thing
It’s odd that it spray after five rounds normally it the opposite I suggest your issue maybe something else with all the Krieger’s you have used are they all fired from the same delivery system.
RB

[Brad Y]

Richard- definitely copper. Lots of streaky bits all randomly throughout the barrel both on top of lands and in grooves. I was using pro shot copper solvent and it was showing copper but after leaving it 5-10 mins all foamed up it usually showed clear after that. Went straight for the heavy stuff in sweets to remove it this time, then went the iosso from there. Its totally shiny now, no caked on carbon, no copper.

Ive had a 22BR howa, 223 and 308 on my rem and only the 308 would work and it took a good 500+ shots to get it going. Shot a few 60's with it but it never set the world on fire. This one just seems to be the same as the rest. Loads never quite get there. I still have VLD's to try as I have only shot hybrids for load development and 168 sierras to fireform in it but Im not sure that will stop the copper problem. I understand copper is supposed to be the lubricant on the barrel but if its rough and picking it up in 14 shots then I dont know if all is right. The gunsmith looked at it and reckoned a barrel should copper that much after a day or twos shooting at a prize meet, not at 14 shots.

It was run in 1 shot clean for 3 shots, then two shot clean, for 4 shots then 3 shots clean for 6 shots etc, didnt see much copper after finishing the 3 shot groups shots and once I had done 20 rounds I was into 5 shot groups then 10 shot groups. When I did my initial ladder test I shot a 60(.4 from memory) and didnt get much of an idea as to what was going to work best. Hybrids definitely seemed to shoot well. But its gone way down hill from there. I may just have to shoot and clean it after each detail for a while. The maddco 6.5mm just worked right from the word go and only after a full days shooting does it need a clean. Barrels aint barrels but when everyone gets such a good result from kriegers I just dont see what Im doing wrong.

[BATattack]

Defiantly don't use abrasives. Don't clean as often and only use a bronze brush and copper solvent at the most. Let the barrel polish and work harden and your copper will go away.

[bartman007]

Brad,

I use a similar (not identical) procedure to yours when running in, so that is all history now as you are over 100 rounds.

If you are getting heaps of copper, how fast are you pushing your projectiles?

I have a couple of 7mm 1:8.5 5R Kriegers and I don't push them over 3000 fps.

I don't get the copper you are finding.

[RAVEN]

Brad ist is a bit odd
when was the last time you put this load over a chrony?

[AlanF]

Brad,

Would be worth trying moly bore paste after you clean it back to bare metal. It saved a barrel for me once. There are two brands I've used Lyman and Brownell's. You can use it without going to molyed bullets. I'm sure it'll make a difference by delaying the fouling significantly, and allow you to clean less aggressively.

Alan

[Brad Y]

Load 52.8gr 2209 over chronograph on 4/5th Jan but have shot maybe twice since then. Was showing around 2820-2850 in spread with jammed bullets. Jumped bullets were closer to 2820 avg with a larger spread either side. This was tested with a magnetospeed V2 so I believe the readings are pretty much correct. Accuracy isnt great, its not bad for a couple of shots but get lots of 10/11oclock fliers. Im going to leave the hybrids for a while and try the VLD's and just look at getting something holding a decent waterline. But the amount of copper is what greatly concerns me.

As a bit on anecdotal fun, my 308 was a tight 298/3065 barrel and I had trouble getting it going without copper fouling up. I put it down to the tight bore cutting into the bullets. I re ran it in about 350 shots in using a patch of trefolex cutting oil then firing a shot over it. After about 20 of those it started to get better and I stopped the trefolex and just used bore pastes to clean it for the next couple of hundred. From there it went much better til I sold it and took up FO. The bloke who owns it now had it rechambered to fit his action and shot a 60 with it same load and all on his gun. But I wont be putting trefolex near this barrel. Just yet anyway...

[Brad Y]

Brad,

Would be worth trying moly bore paste after you clean it back to bare metal. It saved a barrel for me once. There are two brands I've used Lyman and Brownell's. You can use it without going to molyed bullets. I'm sure it'll make a difference by delaying the fouling significantly, and allow you to clean less aggressively.

Alan

Alan I never thought of moly bore paste. Not a bad idea- will see how these VLD's go and the coppering from them during the week. If it is still bad I will take a look at doing something like that. We do have moly powder in the shop but will have to get some JB moly paste or similar from sinclairs no doubt.

[jasmay]

Just putting it out there, but I wonder if this Barrel is a candidate for fire lapping?

There a number of suppliers that do kits/compunds for the purpose, and from what is been desrcibed it sounds like this barrel could benefit from it.

Thoughts?

aqnyone done a barrel before? How were the results?

[RAVEN]

Hi Jas I have the Tubb fire lap kit never used it and I'm sure it would work great but Brad's barrel is only a spring chicken and it should'nt be fouling as bad as it is.
I think the system would improve a hunting rifle barrel

[SENDIT]

Hi brad. Why dont you molly your projectiles? I moly for my 6 and 7mm no excessive fouling

[Norm]

Brad,
Is your barrel clean and dry when you fire your first shot after cleaning back to bare metal?

If so I would shoot the first shot with the barrel lightly oiled up with a good organic light machine oil.

[Brad Y]

Norm, yes I never shoot the first shot on a dry barrel.

[Tim N]

This shooting with oil in the barrel etc sounds a bit scary please explain